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Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls
avatar

Bombi
December 18, 2015 07:43PM

Registered: 11 years ago
Posts: 2,104

I just hope they don't screw up the deal, the petroleum economy is suspect at best but having the export tax eliminated in the budget deal adds another level of interest. The refinery just needs a cost effective energy source to be viable.

optimist with low expectations on STX

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

singlefin
December 19, 2015 12:34AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 665

Thank you once again Carl!
There are several regular posters here who undoubtedly have their own personal agendas on various issues, but political discussions usually brings out the worst of them. Sifting through the various threads of intrest on this site, and finding enlightened, unbiased responses, are truly a breath of freash air. Posters like yourself, as well as a few others, are the only reason I continue to return to this sight.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls
avatar

Dante
December 19, 2015 09:48AM

Registered: 12 years ago
Posts: 253

Quote
OldTart
Quote
Alana33
That's depressing!

It is - but I think the point is that the situation in the USVI isn't unusual. I think a lot of those who move here are really never much involved in local politics stateside but in such a small community here it's pretty much "in your face" and unavoidable. A lot of misinformation gets disseminated on this forum and much of it is, I think, based on an assumption that the shenanigans that go on here are unique to the territory when of course they're not - by a long stretch.

thumbs up

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Beeski
December 19, 2015 09:59AM

Registered: 9 years ago
Posts: 641

Quote
CarlHartmann
I almost never express an opinion--and certainly not on politics.....This is one of those posts I know I should avoid....but here goes....

In addition to the VI, I've lived in New York (Rochester and New York City), DC, New Mexico and Boston. NM and Mass. were ok. But the legislatures in New York and DC were (and I believe still are) FAR, FAR, FAR worse than the VI. Pick any scale....stupid comments, cluelessness, criminality, self-interest, number of officials in jail, amount of damage done....ANY scale. You would not believe the number of NYS legislators that went to jail this year -- even the ex-speaker was convicted. And I'm told it is much worse in Chicago, Louisiana, Florida and now Wisconsin -- don't know for sure.

The problem here is that you are actually paying attention to what happens in politics and what people say. You actually pay attention here. Politicians are worse here??? Geez....watch the DC local news sometime....it makes the VI legislature look like Harvard.

I'll pile on.
In my in-laws West Texas county, the local govt has borrowed to the hilt to build a rodeo / convention center which is used one week a year, and a $12million high school football stadium for a losing program.
My Mom lives in a Central NJ town which borrowed $40mil to build a Taj Mahal High School, property taxes are now 10 times the tax rate in the VI.
It happens everywhere.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls
avatar

CruzanIron
December 19, 2015 02:47PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 2,383

Quote
Beeski
Quote
CarlHartmann
I almost never express an opinion--and certainly not on politics.....This is one of those posts I know I should avoid....but here goes....

In addition to the VI, I've lived in New York (Rochester and New York City), DC, New Mexico and Boston. NM and Mass. were ok. But the legislatures in New York and DC were (and I believe still are) FAR, FAR, FAR worse than the VI. Pick any scale....stupid comments, cluelessness, criminality, self-interest, number of officials in jail, amount of damage done....ANY scale. You would not believe the number of NYS legislators that went to jail this year -- even the ex-speaker was convicted. And I'm told it is much worse in Chicago, Louisiana, Florida and now Wisconsin -- don't know for sure.

The problem here is that you are actually paying attention to what happens in politics and what people say. You actually pay attention here. Politicians are worse here??? Geez....watch the DC local news sometime....it makes the VI legislature look like Harvard.

I'll pile on.
In my in-laws West Texas county, the local govt has borrowed to the hilt to build a rodeo / convention center which is used one week a year, and a $12million high school football stadium for a losing program.
My Mom lives in a Central NJ town which borrowed $40mil to build a Taj Mahal High School, property taxes are now 10 times the tax rate in the VI.
It happens everywhere.

$15,000.00 a year in property taxes? Which county is this in?

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

singlefin
December 19, 2015 04:15PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 665

15k a year is probably about average today on much of Long Island NY.
It's insane.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls
avatar

DanielB_STX
December 19, 2015 05:10PM

Registered: 11 years ago
Posts: 309

singlefin is correct...........

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Beeski
December 19, 2015 08:14PM

Registered: 9 years ago
Posts: 641

Quote
CruzanIron
$15,000.00 a year in property taxes? Which county is this in?

Somerset and Mercer.
Common property tax rates in NJ, NY and CT

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

singlefin
December 21, 2015 10:27PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 665

Anyone hear any news on the Legislatures STX meeting today? Any date set for the vote?

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Alana33
December 22, 2015 05:54AM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 11,847

Daily News has an article today about how long the hearing on STX lasted (into early morning hours) but can't access it as yet. Will post link when it becomes available.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Beeski
December 22, 2015 06:13AM

Registered: 9 years ago
Posts: 641

Here is a link to Legislature TV.
[livestream.com]

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

ms411
December 22, 2015 08:46AM

Registered: 8 years ago
Posts: 3,422

The story is in both Daily News and Avis. I didn't get a chance to read it all, but the first several paragraphs quoted those opposed to the deal, with Adelbert Bryan's opposition cited.

Hopefully the senators will mostly vote yes, regardless of public opinion.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

islandjoan
December 22, 2015 09:17AM

Registered: 11 years ago
Posts: 1,549

I watched a couple of hours of it last night, it was on channel 5 legit (Innovative carries it)

It will probably be rerun for a couple of days, not sure exactly when.

Towards the end I believe Neville James stated that they would vote today.

This is history in the making. Wish we all had a crystal ball to see what impact it will have on the future of STX, the VI, and all who live here.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Alana33
December 22, 2015 09:31AM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 11,847

Daily News link still not available but here's VI Consortium's article:
[viconsortium.com]

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

janeinstx
December 22, 2015 10:24AM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 644

hearing

All 10 hours of it....

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

singlefin
December 22, 2015 11:25AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 665

"Indicators, however, point towards the landmark deal’s approval."

The Consortium article sounds positive.
Let's all hope for a real Christmas miricle!

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

islandjoan
December 22, 2015 11:27AM

Registered: 11 years ago
Posts: 1,549

So I guess I heard it wrong in the hearing. I thought I heard Neville James say they would vote today.

But according to the Avis it looks like they might not vote today.

I only watched until midnight and the Avis story says the meeting adjourned at 1:53 am

Senate President Neville James said the Legislature will take action on the proposed operating agreement during legislative session, which is currently in recess. He said the date on which it will commence will be announced. "Senators will vote their conscience at the appropriate time" he said.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Alana33
December 22, 2015 01:15PM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 11,847

Here's the Daily News article:
[virginislandsdailynews.newspaperdirect.com]

I can't watch 10 hours of a legislative hearing.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

janeinstx
December 22, 2015 01:31PM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 644

confused smiley. I'm a glutton for punishment. I watched all the way thru the first time and then watched again a select 4 or 5 hours....


Quote
Alana33
Here's the Daily News article:
[virginislandsdailynews.newspaperdirect.com]

I can't watch 10 hours of a legislative hearing.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

islandjoan
December 22, 2015 01:32PM

Registered: 11 years ago
Posts: 1,549

I watched about 3 hours of it....

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

singlefin
December 22, 2015 01:45PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 665

Bryan wants 100% "bonifide VI residents" only working there. What exactly is that?
And, under what rock did these "intrested parties" crawl out from under?
Joshua Simcoe
VI Refining
Freedom NY
The Daily News photo of the "people in attendance" last night, looked like very few showed on behalf of STX.
This is all political grandstanding!

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

OldTart
December 22, 2015 01:53PM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 6,524

Quote
singlefin
Bryan wants 100% "bonifide VI residents" only working there. What exactly is that?!

It's a LONG story spanning several decades, part of his schtick. Google his name and you'll find a bunch of information about him.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

Alana33
December 22, 2015 03:10PM

Registered: 6 years ago
Posts: 11,847

I'm not exactly thrilled with ALL of the 100% exemptions listed.
It adds up over a 25 yr. period.
90 - 95% (or less) I can see but the 100% makes me shake my head.
Then divide the money were getting over that same period.

Wonder how much Mapp made.
You can bet he got something.
Nature of the beast.

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

IslandHops
December 22, 2015 03:25PM

Registered: 9 years ago
Posts: 929

I watched/listened to it all. No idea how they selected the 6 individuals from the general public who were allowed to testify. Not sure how you allow only 6, yet Malone can call it "democratic due process". There were very few moments of clarity. One in particular is that day 1 we will likely be losing jobs, not gaining them.

Last year I thought ABR was a 70/30 probability - I was wrong.

This year I'd say Limetree has better odds - but....

Re: Hess Bid. I Don't Understand. Explanation Pls

monogram
December 22, 2015 03:40PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 446

Quote
IslandHops
I watched/listened to it all. No idea how they selected the 6 individuals from the general public who were allowed to testify. Not sure how you allow only 6, yet Malone can call it "democratic due process".

Agreed. They didn't articulate their arguments well. sad smiley Sen. O'Reilly excoriated one of them for not having read the agreements. Funny.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/22/2015 03:45PM by monogram.

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