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Re: new president

Scubadoo
March 22, 2017 10:30PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,647

Quote
rotorhead
I mean why should people be allowed to do dangerous activities, sky-diving, flying, hang gliding, skiing, motocross, etc, etc. Any activity that you consider dangerous could be outlawed because people might incur healthcare costs that you would consider excessive and unfair.

It could be coming and not from the legislators. Health Insurance companies already charge different rates for smokers. Life insurance companies ask all those questions before granting a policy.

Re: new president

LiquidFluoride
March 22, 2017 11:05PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 1,924

Quote
Scubadoo
Quote
rotorhead
I mean why should people be allowed to do dangerous activities, sky-diving, flying, hang gliding, skiing, motocross, etc, etc. Any activity that you consider dangerous could be outlawed because people might incur healthcare costs that you would consider excessive and unfair.

It could be coming and not from the legislators. Health Insurance companies already charge different rates for smokers. Life insurance companies ask all those questions before granting a policy.

But you have a choice (sort of) for health care with out being forced into it.

that's really what this all comes down to.

Do we have the right to force each other to do things?

Now, I'm a parent, so I see that at times (EXTREMELY LIMITED TIMES) one some times does have to step in "save" someone else from what they choose to do. so I do agree that that concept is valid in it's proper implementation. However, it is even recognized legally that "minors" are not capable of making all decisions for themselves until they come "of age"; so restrictions and limitations should always apply.


Extremities aside, I agree that health care should be available to those in need, but I also know how charitable people are when allowed to be.

I also know how wasteful and useless the government is in everything it does, the VI is the perfect example of that, what do they do well, anything?...


So, with those in mind, the logical conclusion seems obvious.

Re: new president

Gator's Mom
March 23, 2017 08:01AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 689

I've heard social security and Medicare referred to as entitlements. These programs are no more entitlements than military benefits.

Social security and Medicare are promised and earned benefits - no different.

If you open the door for Ryan and his ilk to change these and agree with them, then military benefits will be up for examination too. Previous promise or not.

Health insurance is asset insurance. Those that have something to lose will have health insurance by hook or crook. Without ACA, Medicare, Medicaid et.al. hang on to your wallet 'cause you'll pay and pay and pay through increasing rates without any checks or balances.

Is health care a right in the US? If actions speak then it is. Every one gets treated who shows up in the emergency room. This is reality - not the spouting of liberty and freedom. This is the 21st century and the rules have changed. Genie is out of the bottle and even Trump can't shove it back.

Re: new president

JohnnyU
March 23, 2017 10:44AM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 446

Quote
Gator's Mom
I've heard social security and Medicare referred to as entitlements. These programs are no more entitlements than military benefits.

Social security and Medicare are promised and earned benefits - no different.

Earned off the backs of future generations and an unsustainable promise, sounds like a government program alright. Guessing you're lining up at the trough and have a F'everyone I'm getting mine attitude.

Quote

Without ACA, Medicare, Medicaid et.al. hang on to your wallet 'cause you'll pay and pay and pay through increasing rates without any checks or balances.
.

Except there are doctors that are leaving the system and going to a cash system, which is much cheaper. Though one would need to plan and that's not everyone's strong suit and unfortunately there's no way to opt out without going completely off the grid

Quote

Genie is out of the bottle and even Trump can't shove it back.

It's too bad that the majority of Americans aren't intelligent enough to understand there's no such thing as a free lunch.

Re: new president

Gumbo
March 23, 2017 10:45AM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 457

Social Security is a benefit for those that contributed, For those that didn't it's an entitlement.

Re: new president

Gator's Mom
March 23, 2017 11:02AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 689

Actually social security is a social insurance program. True, you get more if you contribute more. It is not a bank account.


[en.wikipedia.org]

Quote
Gumbo
Social Security is a benefit for those that contributed, For those that didn't it's an entitlement.

Re: new president

Gator's Mom
March 23, 2017 11:05AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 689

Naivety is no excuse for being misinformed.

[www.ssa.gov]

Quote
JohnnyU
Quote
Gator's Mom
I've heard social security and Medicare referred to as entitlements. These programs are no more entitlements than military benefits.

Social security and Medicare are promised and earned benefits - no different.

Earned off the backs of future generations and an unsustainable promise, sounds like a government program alright. Guessing you're lining up at the trough and have a F'everyone I'm getting mine attitude.

Quote

Without ACA, Medicare, Medicaid et.al. hang on to your wallet 'cause you'll pay and pay and pay through increasing rates without any checks or balances.
.

Except there are doctors that are leaving the system and going to a cash system, which is much cheaper. Though one would need to plan and that's not everyone's strong suit and unfortunately there's no way to opt out without going completely off the grid

Quote

Genie is out of the bottle and even Trump can't shove it back.

It's too bad that the majority of Americans aren't intelligent enough to understand there's no such thing as a free lunch.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2017 11:26AM by Gator's Mom.

Re: new president

JohnnyU
March 23, 2017 12:16PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 446

You have to edit that 2X to post a link to a tome and not answer any of my points?

Re: new president

Gator's Mom
March 23, 2017 12:28PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 689

You are naïve and misinformed.

Quote
JohnnyU
You have to edit that 2X to post a link to a tome and not answer any of my points?

Re: new president

Gumbo
March 23, 2017 01:17PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 457

Quote
Gator's Mom
Actually social security is a social insurance program. True, you get more if you contribute more. It is not a bank account.


[en.wikipedia.org]

Quote
Gumbo
Social Security is a benefit for those that contributed, For those that didn't it's an entitlement.

I guess that's what happens when the government is in the insurance business.
The people that pay have to cover everyone, just like Obama care.

Re: new president

JohnnyU
March 23, 2017 02:54PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 446

Quote
Gator's Mom
You are naïve and misinformed.

Quote
JohnnyU
You have to edit that 2X to post a link to a tome and not answer any of my points?
[/quote

With facts like that, you've convinced me

LOFL

Re: new president

Spartygrad95
March 23, 2017 03:54PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,870

Truman's interview with Time is something right out of an SNL skit. I'm not linking it because my tablet is on fritz. Read it though. It is kind boggling that someone with this fragile of an ego and this limited capacity for both basic govt knowledge and vocabulary is the leader of the free world. This sh!t show is entertaining at least.

Re: new president

Alana33
March 23, 2017 06:23PM

Registered: 5 years ago
Posts: 11,580

List of countries with universal healthcare:

[en.m.wikipedia.org]

[truecostblog.com]

[www.forbes.com]

Re: new president

LiquidFluoride
March 23, 2017 09:02PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 1,924

They should write a bill that 20% of the annual salary that would be payed to a human worker that was replaced by a robot goes into a health care fund.

we'll have fully funded health care in less than 5 years that way wink Maybe more like 2, depending on how quickly automated trucking rolls out.

Re: new president

Spartygrad95
March 23, 2017 10:19PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,870

Quote
LiquidFluoride
They should write a bill that 20% of the annual salary that would be payed to a human worker that was replaced by a robot goes into a health care fund.

we'll have fully funded health care in less than 5 years that way wink Maybe more like 2, depending on how quickly automated trucking rolls out.

I believe Gates suggested something like this.

Re: new president

watruw8ing4
March 24, 2017 09:04AM

Registered: 10 years ago
Posts: 849

Quote
Gator's Mom
I've heard social security and Medicare referred to as entitlements. These programs are no more entitlements than military benefits.

Social security and Medicare are promised and earned benefits - no different.

If you open the door for Ryan and his ilk to change these and agree with them, then military benefits will be up for examination too. Previous promise or not.

Health insurance is asset insurance. Those that have something to lose will have health insurance by hook or crook. Without ACA, Medicare, Medicaid et.al. hang on to your wallet 'cause you'll pay and pay and pay through increasing rates without any checks or balances.

Is health care a right in the US? If actions speak then it is. Every one gets treated who shows up in the emergency room. This is reality - not the spouting of liberty and freedom. This is the 21st century and the rules have changed. Genie is out of the bottle and even Trump can't shove it back.

Actually, the SS Act bill itself describes it as an entitlement, and by definition, it is. Just another perfectly good word conservatives hijacked and redefined as a negative talking point. But I agree, the rhetoric is lofty, but does not reflect the reality of a compassionate (at least til now) society unwilling to leave even all those "Live Free 'or Die" people to die in the street.

Re: new president

LiquidFluoride
March 24, 2017 09:13AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 1,924

Quote
watruw8ing4
Actually, the SS Act bill itself describes it as an entitlement, and by definition, it is. Just another perfectly good word conservatives hijacked and redefined as a negative talking point.

I don't see negativity, just accuracy.

Nothing can be gotten for free with out theft. Entitlement is a big word for theft. (at least, as long as we aren't communists / socialists i guess).

I'm all for benefits (do something, get something) not a big fan of entitlements (do nothing, get something).



Quote
watruw8ing4
leave even all those "Live Free 'or Die" people to die in the street.

Funny how those type of people are rarely found "in the street"...

I wonder what percentage of "homeless" are willingly so?

I know of at least 2 here on STX that live that way by choice.

Re: new president

Gator's Mom
March 24, 2017 10:08AM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 689

[paycheck-chronicles.military.com]

[www.military.com]

Better be ready to write a check back to the DOD. Referenced above, military paystubs even have a section called Entitlements. LMAO

Oh wait .... that's different .....

Quote
LiquidFluoride
Quote
watruw8ing4
Actually, the SS Act bill itself describes it as an entitlement, and by definition, it is. Just another perfectly good word conservatives hijacked and redefined as a negative talking point.

I don't see negativity, just accuracy.

Nothing can be gotten for free with out theft. Entitlement is a big word for theft. (at least, as long as we aren't communists / socialists i guess).

I'm all for benefits (do something, get something) not a big fan of entitlements (do nothing, get something).



Quote
watruw8ing4
leave even all those "Live Free 'or Die" people to die in the street.

Funny how those type of people are rarely found "in the street"...

I wonder what percentage of "homeless" are willingly so?

I know of at least 2 here on STX that live that way by choice.

Re: new president

LiquidFluoride
March 24, 2017 03:44PM

Registered: 4 years ago
Posts: 1,924

Quote
Gator's Mom
Better be ready to write a check back to the DOD. Referenced above, military paystubs even have a section called Entitlements. LMAO

Oh wait .... that's different .....

Yes, an entitlement you receive after singing a contract for service, so it's a benefit of service, those entitlements...

Sorry is using words in complex ways not working for you?



What do you think your response here reads like, to others?

do we need to circle back to benefit vs entitlement again?

I mean I thought I broke it down as far as possible with:

BENEFIT = GET SOMETHING FOR DOING SOMETHING

ENTITLEMENT = GET SOMETHING FOR DOING NOTHING


now do you understand why your post is a bit silly (or do you still not understand the difference between the two concepts)?

Re: new president

Spartygrad95
March 24, 2017 06:04PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,870

Are we tried of winning yet?

#MAGAHAHAHAHA

Trump taking Ls is the best thing all week

Re: new president
avatar

rotorhead
March 24, 2017 06:42PM

Registered: 12 years ago
Posts: 2,440

Go Libertarians. No Obamacare Lite.
[rare.us]

Re: new president

Spartygrad95
March 24, 2017 07:44PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,870

To claim it was only republicans who smoke weed who kept this from passing is disingenuous. The more they tailored the bill to the Randoids the more moderate Rs pulled away.

Re: new president

Gumbo
March 24, 2017 08:09PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 457

I think waiting for the ACA to implode on its own is the best move anyway. Then not even Pelosi will be able to defend it.

The little I knew of it, I wasn't a fan. I'd rather wait and hope for something better that the federal government doesn't subsidize. We are not a socialist country.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/24/2017 08:20PM by Gumbo.

Re: new president

Spartygrad95
March 24, 2017 08:59PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,870

Quote
Gumbo
I think waiting for the ACA to implode on its own is the best move anyway. Then not even Pelosi will be able to defend it.

The little I knew of it, I wasn't a fan. I'd rather wait and hope for something better that the federal government doesn't subsidize. We are not a socialist country.

This always makes lol...
1. Interstate System
2. Prisons
3. Schools
4. Libraries
5. Etc
Etc
Etc

Health care costs will only go down when greedy, for profit, insurers are out of the game. We spend more for less BECAUSE we do not have single payer.

Re: new president

Scubadoo
March 24, 2017 09:03PM

Registered: 3 years ago
Posts: 1,647

Quote
LiquidFluoride
Yes, an entitlement you receive after signing a contract for service

ENTITLEMENT = GET SOMETHING FOR DOING NOTHING

Now I'm confused.confused smiley Normally I deal with basic math. If A = B and B = C then A = C.

So "signing a contract for service" = "GET SOMETHING FOR DOING NOTHING"?

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