OT: HR3200 - you may read the health care reform bill as it develops

i HAVE AN IDEA. MOVE EVERYONE TO MEDICARE. IT EXISTS AND THEN CHARGE PEOPLE FOR WHAT IT COSTS. MAKE SURE THAT EVERYONE IN THE GOVERNMENT IS ON THEN SAME PLAN. THEN ADJUST IT GOING FORWARD. AFTERALL IT EXISTS TODAY AND WORKS ACCORDING TO THE GOVERNMENT.

NOW GET RID OF ALL THE SENATORS THAT HAVE DEBATED THIS, TRASH THE 1000 PAGE DOCUMENT, AND GET ON TO IMPORTANT THINGS.

JUST A THOUGHT!

BILLD

The health care debate has revealed that Americans suffer from compassion deficiency. Many would prefer that our fellow citizens go without medical care rather than make even the slightest of sacrifices.
There have been many groans and crying of " I don't want to pay for someone else's visits to the doctor". While President Obama insists that changes in our medical system will not require middle-class tax hikes, it is plain that many fear reform will cost them. They wear that statement "Why should I Pay" as a badge of honor.
The pandemic of the attitude of that's not my problem is appalling. So the uninsured and under insured will continue to have bake sales to help pay for the cost of medical care.
Just for the record the Govt runs the largest Health Care System in the USA. It's called the VA.

"No one would be required to pay more than 11 percent of their income,"
Donna Christensen said August 17, 2009.
Great!
Problem is, those that pay 0 in income taxes, pay 0!
Also, drug money & stolen goods aren`t included as income so, the people who use the hospitals the most, will pay the least.
The rest of us, who report our income will have to pay & subsidize the rest(I also have a VERY, VERY big problem with this)

And,
stiphy,

TRW,

I think food should be "free" too...we need it to survive as well. Oh and internet because knowledge should be "free" as well.

One problem, someone has to MAKE this stuff and expects to be compensated for their time..

Stiphy, we already have "free food" for those unable(or unwilling) to work, it`s called food stamps erm, food credit cards!
We also have free(or nearly free) housing, 3 shopping carts full of WIC free food checks, welfare, and unemployment with extended benifits!
Or, 56 weeks of a free ride!
I personally know someone who after years of working is on this 56 week free ride, & now that they have a taste of this free ride, don`t want to work anymore!
This person COMPLAINS of being at the beach everyday & is BORED!
Many times, we can`t get a hold of this person BC sometimes they sleep until 11!

I haven`t had ONE SINGLE &*()%##$ day off I havent personally paid for(or earned from MY job) my ENTIRE LIFE!

Must be NICE being a LEECH!

For the rest Stiphy, I say 'you cant GIVE something away for FREE with out TAKING it from someone else"

If we are to have this social system, everyone should get out what they put into it, and that should also be the rule if we want to continue this democrosy as well.

The American Republic will endure, until politicians realize they can bribe the people with their own money.

-- Alexis de Tocqueville

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/18/opinion/18herbert.html?_r=1&hpw

If you support reform or oppose it, base your decision on fact. But lets stop the canard about losing choice or rationing, because the insurance companies did that a long time ago. The Bean Counters call many medical treatments "experimental" so the Insurance companies don't pay. It makes me feel warm and fuzzy that an accounting MBA, participates in my health care.

If you support reform or oppose it, base your decision on fact.

HITH can anyone do that?
Thousands of pages of text unread by "our" elected reps?
Politicians changing their tune every day?

HELL YES I"M ONE OF THE PO,d !
I VOTE AND I WILL REMEMBER.

Hey Michael,
Your going to compare a human life with a mortgage, a house spec, a coke plant. Give me a break. You look into the eyes of a child with leukemia, a teenager with a brain tumor who suffer and die because they have no medical insurance and cant receive the proper medical care. You Vote "Big deal". What's your objection, that your disposable income might be affected. The private insurance industry just loves opinions like yours. Maybe its time for the Politicos to be concerned for all the people (Kids cant vote)!

i'm so tired of the "nimby" attitude in this thread,on another thread someone made mention of losing ones faith in humanity,i for one have never had faith in humanity as a whole and THIS thread is a perfect example of that

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality-of-Life_Index

DARTMOUTH, Mass. – Rep. Barney Frank lashed out at protester who held a poster depicting President Barack Obama with a Hitler-style mustache during a heated town hall meeting on federal health care reform.

"On what planet do you spend most of your time?" Frank asked the woman, who had stepped up to the podium at a southeastern Massachusetts senior center to ask why Frank supports what she called a Nazi policy.

"Ma'am, trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to argue with a dining room table. I have no interest in doing it," Frank replied.

He continued by saying her ability to deface an image of the president and express her views "is a tribute to the First Amendment that this kind of vile, contemptible nonsense is so freely propagated."

The health care debate has revealed that Americans suffer from compassion deficiency.

I fail to see how taking something from one person to give it to another is compassion. To me it is theft. And yes, I realize our government does it all the time...but it doesn't make it right and I don't want to introduce it into yet another facet of society.

I love the fact that so many people who decry the evils of our welfare and public housing all of a sudden are for socialized medicine.

I am not a conservative and do not like the misinformation campaign they are putting out. Unfortunately it seems like the only thing many American's respond to anymore is fear and both sides use it to acheive their goals rather than have a rational debate.

Sean

Lizard I am blinded by your logic. One person's suffering is license to steal from another.
How about my father-in-law who just had a stroke and guess what we are bringing him with us to care for him.
Who do you think is paying for his care? How about we come and take some money from you to defray expenses?

trw where do you get this nimby thing? What do you know about me? Or the fact I raised my kids and paid for there health insurance while I did without because I couldn't afford it? Now I have a mouthful of bad teeth and need surgery on my feet. You said you hold berkshire hathaway did you not? You are doing a lot better than I.
Guess I'll get my gun and come help you redistribute your earnings as you seem to be happy to have the feds do that to me? Sound OK?

1984 is here. Big brother has redefined the meaning of words.
Theft is compassion.
Freedom is slavery, Ignorance is strength.
All animals are equal. Some are more equal than others.

Scientia est Potentia but apparently not here.

Y'all have a good day.

Stiphy,
Maybe as you mature a little, you will realize compassion is not theft!

Michael,
Sorry about your father-in-Law, but don't confuse medical insurance with long term care insurance.

yeah not bad for a waiter,but it doesn't pay dividends so i work like everyone else, the american idea is something that is in constant evolution,EVERYTHING is connected

LOL, here we go again. I am mature enough to take care of myself, thank you. I wish the same could be said for others who want to force me to take care of them as well.

Sean

Here's a (bit of a rhetorical) question I have for those who want to live with socialized medicine (or socialism in general). What's stopping you? Why not just go do it. Clearly a lot of American's want this system, why not ignore those who don't and do it anyway without the government? Those who want it are free to persue it are they not? What's to stop them from getting together and creating the system whereby every member pays in a certain amount of money and gets guaranteed healthcare. Members who couldn't afford it could join for free based on their income providing "universal coverage." What's stopping you?

Sean

Obesity is an epidemic. The health care system is in a crisis. The latter is largely due to the former.

Heart disease, hypertension, [lung] cancer, diabetes, stroke, and age-related dementia are for the most part, self-inflicted diseases and account for the lion's share of health care costs.

What we have is a nation where two-thirds of the population makes life style choices that directly result in disease and then EXPECTS that a system be in place to save themselves from their own refusal to make responsible choices.

Obesity is costing this nation in ways that negatively permeates almost every aspect of our daily lives.

Overhauling our health care system SHOULD include making people responsible. If one chooses to live an unhealthy lifestyle then they should shoulder a larger burden of the costs associated with the resulting health issues they face.

The really frightening part of the ongoing debate over health care is that since the majority of people are either overweight or obese, as a voting bloc they will inevitably control the outcome - and that outcome will no doubt end with those that opt for a healthy lifestyle subsidizing those that don't.

Stiphy,
That's easy (the Bernie Madoff's in our society) stops that! Just a point for your edification the insurance industry is regulated by the Govt. not only the Fed, all states have their own banking and insurance commission that regulate as well. Just Think if all the people burned by Bernie would have been insured how happy they would be today. Oh did you know that one of the Banks on STX are not covered by the FDIC.

Lizard,

I am very aware of the government regulation involved in our insurance industry. I think its interesting that the medical insurance industry is regulated by multiple levels of government, yet has been identified by almost everyone involved as being a big part of the problem.

Maybe if we had freedom instead of regulation we'd have better insurance options. I see incredible irony and feel frustration that the government simultaneously restricts individuals and corporations from coming up with solutions to our healthcare crisis while proposing a solution of its own, one which would not be voluntary from a funding standpoint.

Is the answer then less regulation so those who wish to socialize or offer alternatives would be free to do so of their own accord?

Sean

Oh, I know which bank you speak of as well, I belive they are actually in very good shape financially though. That said, I don't use them.

Hey rkurpiers,
That's a pretty wide brush you use for (most part self-inflicted diseases).

Stiphy,
Maybe you can educate me on what the insurance industry, corporations, and individuals have proposed to help the Health care system out. Also can you tell me what the Govt has done to the industry that has created problems. Without Govt oversight do you think you would be able to get insurance (not only you). I can give you one example of what insurance companies tried to pull off in the State on NJ. They no longer wanted to write auto insurance in the state because of assigned risk drivers. but they wanted home ,health, life , Long term care. The State had to step in and tell them all or nothing. these companies were Geico, State Farm, liberty mutual, All State, Prudential which is Headquartered in NJ. Blue Cross Blue shield which was/is a not for profit company and now wants to be a for profit company.

Stiphy,
Maybe you can educate me on what the insurance industry, corporations, and individuals have proposed to help the Health care system out.

What part of wage and price controls during WW2 don't you understand?

Ma'am, trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to argue with a dining room table. I have no interest in doing it.

Michael,
Would you care to elaborate on that. Wage and price controls during ww2.

Hey rkurpiers,
That's a pretty wide brush you use for (most part self-inflicted diseases).

While I admittedly use it, I didn't make the brush. The cause and effect relationships are well-documented and largely indisputable.