Legalized Prostituition  

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speee1dy
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what do you think of Chucky Hansens proposal to legalize prostitution

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AandA2VI
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LF... If your wife was previously a prostitute say in a legal place like bunny ranch would you have married her? Just wondering.

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iguanabanana
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LF... If your wife was previously a prostitute say in a legal place like bunny ranch would you have married her? Just wondering.

Whoa. Don't mean to be inflammatory, but what does this have to do with your said outrage about this being about taxes? In my opinion, that is a shocking and very nasty, judgmental question (though I know you are a very kind, animal loving person). Just sayin...

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BeachcomberStt
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Only heterosexual prostitution is being discussed as legalized. How about homosexual prostitution, especially male on male? Is that going to be taxed? What about that scenario?

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speee1dy
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such an interesting discussion going on.

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iguanabanana
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Only heterosexual prostitution is being discussed as legalized. How about homosexual prostitution, especially male on male? Is that going to be taxed? What about that scenario?

I think that is an excellent question which I wish I understood as well. Perhaps it is easier to paint women as victims when we are wanting to paint pictures of victims so that we can win an argument.

I just found this article ( Why the Women’s Rights Movement Must Listen to Sex Workers), and think it should be a must-read for anyone engaging in this debate. It presents some views of women and men who are advocates in the sex workers rights movement. I was left thinking, again, how arrogant it is that we have these debates assuming we know what it is sex workers want/need.

A few quotes:

“The key demand of the sex workers’ movement in Burma, in Asia and all around the world is simple. We demand that sex work is recognized as work. But we have one other key demand, specific to certain parts of the women’s movement. We demand that we are not treated as victims.”

"To label and disregard these advocates as “victims” who cannot comprehend their true “enslavement” is condescending, disempowering, and untrue. They are fighting for their human rights with creativity and agency and in defiance of deep societal and legal marginalization, forming a chorus of agitation for the right to work, the right to live free from violence, the right to access healthcare."

"“We live in daily fear of being ‘rescued.’ The violence happens when feminist rescue organisations work with the police who break into our work places and beat us, rape us and kidnap our children in order to ‘save’ us…"

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AandA2VI
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Sorry if that was rude or anything... My question is purely inquisitive... Not meant to insult. I wonder if the guys who say HEY it's their choice and its ok.... Actually the women too for that matter would be proud of their sister, mother or marry a woman who was formerly a prostitute. I'd assume not very many at all would be ok with this concept which I find very contradictory. If you think its too "dirty" or "taboo" for your involvement but you support it for others, i just cant understand that. That's really why I was asking. No offense meant LF, just wanted some insight from a supporter.

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LiquidFluoride
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LF... If your wife was previously a prostitute say in a legal place like bunny ranch would you have married her? Just wondering.

well, I buy used cars & have dated women that lived before I met them, (she falls in to the second category of course).

This is sorta like asking if you'd buy a car from a rental fleet right?

I honestly can say I don't think it would matter, though maybe I'd inspect the err.. "drive train" a bit more before I took it out for a spin 😉

While it's one of the harder concepts in life, (especially with Ego intervening all the time) I've found that Acceptance is a great way to live.

This doesn't mean I give up, or give in, or don't care; its sort of like the serenity prayer (I've agnostically modified it)

Seek the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference.

A lot of wisdom in those AA meetings, it's unfortunate that it takes a life altering addiction for some people to find it.

And with that in mind, I accept people for what they have done, and who they are RIGHT NOW, because RIGHT NOW is all that ever matters & is all that we actually experience/ can do anything about.

Only heterosexual prostitution is being discussed as legalized. How about homosexual prostitution, especially male on male? Is that going to be taxed? What about that scenario?

I don't think the conversation was limited to strictly heterosexual (though perhaps in some peoples mind it was/is) that just happens to be the larger sampling.

I have no problem with either being treated as the same, we have a pretty open gay/lesbian community on the island it seems (hell there's even a hotel that seems to cater to that life style on STX) but again, we might see prejudice rear it's head on that one, especially on this island that seems to be a chunk of the bible belt relocated to the ocean.

edit:

No offense means LF, just wanted some insight from a supporter.

Oh none taken, I think it is a valid integrity check you just preformed, perhaps something for other people to read and consider.

In fact I think that taking it as an insult lends credibility to the fact that it's a "bad thing" or taboo or something similar.

If you had asked me if I would marry an X-rodeo clown I should respond similarly if I truly believe what I say.

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BeachcomberStt
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Forgot these scenarios - male prostitutes for females, bi-sexual male prostitutes, transvestites, transsexuals, or lesbian prostitutes. Legal or not? In this bill or not?

LF

we might see prejudice rear it's head on that one, especially on this island that seems to be a chunk of the bible belt relocated to the ocean.

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OldTart
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In this bill or not?]

This discussion goes way beyond what Senator Hansen has or hasn't proposed which, in any case, is really moot. The good Senator is famous for her frivolous exercises in futility and the only thing that ever comes out of them is success in remaining in her constituents' minds. Her supporters' minds aren't exactly in the top percentile where intelligence is concerned so they continually need reminding that she's still around and working hard to earn her magnificent salary. WHAT she says is irrelevant as long as she says it loudly and often. Doubt this proposal of hers will ever make it for even discussion at any level unless in some obscure sub-sub-sub committee ...

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BeachcomberStt
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OT,
Oops, reading so much of this thread forgot it was just a proposal by Senator Hanson.
Agree what you said about her.

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blu4u
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But currently have families and business struggling and closing up because of the electric costs? EVERY OUNCE of energy from the people, senators and government would be better served into making the VI more stable. Cleaning up the roads to increase tourism, supporting young mothers who can't seem to teach their kids the difference between right and wrong.

I think this whole concept should be a slap in the face (from this Chucky broad) to the people who live in the VI.

well, I agree to some extent, I think it should be a choice what you do with your body, if you want to go the strange penis route, ok, if not, fine.

The problem is this:

How 'bout trying to attract legitimate business that will grow the economy and provide real career type jobs.

Ok, what "legitimate" business exactly could these tiny islands attract? What resources do we have (none but beaches & nice weather that I can think of) What infrastructure do we have that would attract businesses (none... actually less than none since our power is so expensive and highly unreliable).

The point is, what business can we attract that is not already here (none) and with that in mind why don't we try to leverage the business opportunities that are already here?

Industries for the USVI:
1) Call centers. No brainer! Easy jobs with flexible hours for well mannered folks.
2) Flim and TV locations and production studios. Look at New Mexico. NM. does not have tropical locals. The VI has it all over HI. Especially with new techno for underwater filming.
3) UVI -enovormental sciences programs. Get this, at my D's top tier state side college, semesters abroad are very popular. The cost is roughly 20K for three months. Turn UVI into top tier enviromental science insitution. ASU did this for the business school. Now AZ is has one the fastest growing business climates.
4) Follow the new model of eco/adventure tourism. STOP developing beaches into hotels complexes. Look how much the average STJ visitor drops per day. Why is STJ so attractive? Because of the undeveloped beaches!

We need to look beyond what's worked in the past and see the future. Hotel rooms and luxury develpments on the sand do not provide sustainable jobs.

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blu4u
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How much revenue is expected from legalizing (aka regulating) hookers?

Can it compare to over $2.5 million per week PLUS?

".....[Fast Five] spent 13 weeks shooting in Puerto Rico between July and October of [2010]. The crew filmed on the streets of Rio Piedras (a town in San Juan), the Old State Penitentiary Building, the Teodoro Moscoso Bridge in San Juan and the town of Naranjito, among other locations. In all, "Fast Five" employed 236 technicians, 13,145 extras and generated 16,824 room nights at hotels, contributing $27 million to the local economy, officials said..." http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/entertainmentnewsbuzz/puerto-rico/ And that doesn't count associated revenue from the crew's out of pocket expenses. Or the great PR generated.

STX is ideal. C'sted is could stand in for any Colonial Carb location. The farm lands. The rainforest. The old sugar mills. The seaplane dock. Two forts. F'sted waterfront. Heck even the abadoned refinery. Not to mention the all the insane beaches. The north shore. The tide pools and rocky coast. Serviced by commerical carriers. Pleanty of rooms.

I wonder who paid Sen. Hansen to make that ridiculous prostitution proposal in the first place. Follow the money...

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PeteyToo
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Well now that the "appointed" DPNR Chief got pinched, "Chuckie" needs to secure her pension somehow...... Got Votes?

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JahRustyFerrari
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LF... If your wife was previously a prostitute say in a legal place like bunny ranch would you have married her? Just wondering.

The prostitute feels no emotional commitment to the client. As a matter of fact, they tend to look down on the client.
In a way, the man who actually gets a prostitute to marry him must have a lot going for him. The client is forgotten as soon as he/she leaves the room. All that remains is the money. The prostitute often feels that the client is a fool for having paid for a physical act with absolutely no emotional component. To actually be able to reach such a woman to the point of getting her to marry you is quite an accomplishment. The female body is remarkably resilient...a month or two of abstinence erases all traces of former johns...childbirth is more traumatic physically.
Most of the DR girls who work here are very family-oriented. They are also very religious, and believe that they will be forgiven for doing what they had to do to support their families. The man who actually manages to marry one of these often very beautiful women will find himself with a totally devoted, domesticated partner who is only interested in taking care of him and her family. A number of men from the defunct refinery met and married DR girls while they were here. From all accounts, they are quite happy...some have even moved to the DR.
BTW, STD's are not being spread here by the prostitutes, who won't let anyone near them without protection. STD's are more likely being spread by all those people parking in cars in the bushes all over the island with no protection.

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loungestx
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The problem with legal prostitution is not the moral or tax problems, it is that whatever legal boundaries are placed before people they tend to push beyond, if the speed limit is 55 we drive 65 if it was 65 we would drive 75. And that is not the people we worry about, the worry is the people that always go a bit too far. So if it is legal you may get the person who would never have gone before to a prostitute to maybe visit one, but having a legal sex trade will also bring the mkt for illegal sex trade up with it, IE underage prostitution, (has anyone ever been to Costa Rica where they put up posters at the airports warning folks not to engage in underage prostitution). Now knowing that illegal activity will follow what would be legal is not always a reason not to allow it but you have to be ready to handle what will follow. Do you feel that the island policing and courts are of a level to curtail the illegal trade that will also step up with the legal? As said, it is probably a moot point but since we are talking about it...

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Jamison
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I wonder if we'd open new whorehouses or would the existing ones just be taxed?

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noOne
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JahRusty back in the late 80s I shared an apartment with a guy from the DR. Every Friday after getting his paycheck, he would go downtown CA to visit this one particular bar that had a bunch of beds in back. I was 18 or 19 at the time, so I really wasn't interested in going out back - besides I was only earning $4.50 an hour...

But you are right about the Dominican girls doing this for a better life for themselves and their families

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JohnLPC
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A different, almost surreal perspective (this post not intended to derail the discussion or minimize compelling issues related to autonomy, personal and/or societal welfare, and human dignity ... it's only intended to broaden the scope of discussion):

MEET THE FOKKENS : Sisters doing it for themselves in Amsterdam's Red Light District

<>
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/meet_the_fokkens/

<>
http://www.meetthefokkens.com/synopsis

On the possible "up side": Dutch health insurance companies have an obligation to accept everyone for the basic health insurance package, irrespective of gender, age and health. I hope that clause includes avocation and career, too.

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lily1025
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maybe it's me,but i feel everyone might be missing the point[ways to increase revenue in the territory].like any other successful Caribbean island,tourism is the backbone of their economy.with all the natural beauty,history,and water sports available in the territory,do people really want to attract tourists seeking legal prostitution? i doubt these type of tourists will be staying at resorts like the divi,carambola etc or spending their money on local watersports or resturants. i doubt an island which might promote legal prostitution would be an "ideal"choice for a family vacation. what concerns me the most is the message this sends to our local youth. we already have problems with decling morality,violence,and excessive teenage pregnancies.i would hate to think that a young woman,most likely a high school dropout that prostitution would be a way to earn a living rather than to get a skill or continue their education,similar to the draws of drug dealing only it is legal. i know this is only my opinion,based on some presumptions,but i doubt legal prostition will lower the cost of my wapa bill or help solve the financial mess of our hospitals and schools.

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OldTart
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It's really a moot point. It will never happen.

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blu4u
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lilly. I couldn't agree more. It's good to know that folks, like you, take the long term interest of our territory to heart. Thank you.

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noOne
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I thought this would be a good info graphic to present:

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