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Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

I also fail to see what white collar opportunities these thugs actually created. Do you really need a college degree to sit in a call center and collect personal information from your victims?

Somebody got to develop the web sites and algorithms/models and write all the software behind that, setup up some computer hardware and servers, keep track of all the financials, etc. STX's own little .com boom I guess.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 2:45 am
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

Oh Please - you can justify anything but the fact is they aren't really helping these people by creating even more debt for them. Learn to distinguish right from wrong.

"Usury is the practice of making unethical or immoral monetary loans intended to unfairly enrich the lender. A loan may be considered usurious because of excessive or abusive interest rates or other factors, but according to some dictionaries, simply charging any interest at all can be considered usury."

"Someone who charges usury can be called an usurer, but the more common term in English is loan shark."

If it walks like a duck, etc.

I'd get some new friends because these guys are crooks in suits sitting behind computers any which way you wish to look at it while you're busy glad-handing and sticking up for them. Repulsive.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 12:06 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Learn to distinguish right from wrong.

Likewise, consumers should learn how to read. Stupid CAN be fixed to a degree were people not so quick to sign on the dotted line without examining what a contract says. IF what this company is doing falls afoul of US or local lending law then it will be addressed as it's been addressed in various states over the last decades. But none of these reports so far seem to demonstrate that any laws have been or are being broken.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 12:29 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

No laws are being broken, yet as the VI tends to be decades behind in enacting good laws that prevent corruption while turning the blind eye as we can see with the Chucky Hansen debacle, for instance. Morals and ethics, aside.

Face it, these guys take advantage of the desperate and the disenfranchised who have very little to no options.

I cannot remember the exact quote but "evil flourishes when good men do nothing."

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Posted : September 11, 2014 1:21 pm
RevFD
(@RevFD)
Advanced Member

The cosa nostra joke aside, my views on these individuals and the practice of payday lending in general is far from a knee jerk reaction though. Sure we get it, these guys are sophisticated risk managers, niche players, and perhaps they need to charge insane interest rates to make their business model work.

The real issue, as stated over and over, is that payday lenders thrive on desperate people with little to no clue of basic financial concepts. The counter arguments for providing financial flexibility and more efficient markets should in my opinion be compared to the collateral damage that come with. In many cases you provide only temporary relief, setting people up for even greater financial distress down the road (I bet that variable is not in the computer model). Hence, the rationale and proliferation of usury legislation.

Hiding behind non-transparent offshore entities with the intent to circumvent such regulation is plain shady and speaks a lot of the character of these individuals.

The mob also kills people, extorts money for protection and forces people to do business with them whether they want to or not. That is the problem with the mob. And that is why we don't want to hand this industry (along with booze and gambling) back to a resurgent mob.

These guys offer a product that people are free to use or not based on their own needs, thoughts, and desires. They employ high level mathmaticians and statisticians to figure out how to do it profitably just like any other financial business. They employ marketing people to figure out how to get people to know about thier products. All of this right here on St. Croix.

It is very easy to lose a lot of money giving payday loans as without a great degree of computer modeling you can end up with over 50% of your money being stolen by people who never pay a dime back. It is a very risky business. Before you make a knee jerk reaction on a busness that is conducted between 2 people voluntarily without any coecion I would just ask that you actually know something about the business. Clearly this is a business people don't understand, don't want to understand and just want to ban even if it solves nothing for those they want to help in the end.

Sean

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Posted : September 11, 2014 3:51 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Hiding behind non-transparent offshore entities with the intent to circumvent such regulation is plain shady and speaks a lot of the character of these individuals.

There is still no indication that the operation is illegal. Payday loans are not, I believe, legal in the USVI and the maximum interest allowed on legal lending is capped in accordance with the laws governing small loans.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 4:21 pm
MosquitoBaitt
(@MosquitoBaitt)
Advanced Member

The people who are HATERS of these loan companies (for making money) have obviously NEVER been down and out to a point of desperation for a few bucks to get to the end of the week/month.

The borrower makes a conscious decision to borrow the cash and pay it back with high interest, OBVIOUSLY they have expired any and all other possibilities by the time they do this.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 7:10 pm
noOne
(@noOne)
Trusted Member

Sorry, but that is why we have the social nets of welfare and food stamps, along with privately and publicly run food banks, and why that type of lending is at least shady...

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Posted : September 11, 2014 10:09 pm
rotorhead
(@rotorhead)
Trusted Member

This is your standard liberal vs conservative split.

Liberals think that we should all be treated like children. We are not capable of reading contracts and understanding them. The government must be there to protect us from ourselves. If you make a bad decision then the government will take care of it's children.

If you borrow money and can't repay it then the government will label the people that loaned you the money a scoundrel and a thug. But you, the person who borrowed the money knowing the terms of the loan in advance, you are not a deadbeat, you were victimized.

The do's and the don'ts yet again.

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Posted : September 11, 2014 11:01 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

This is your standard liberal vs conservative split.

Liberals think that we should all be treated like children. We are not capable of reading contracts and understanding them. The government must be there to protect us from ourselves. If you make a bad decision then the government will take care of it's children.

If you borrow money and can't repay it then the government will label the people that loaned you the money a scoundrel and a thug. But you, the person who borrowed the money knowing the terms of the loan in advance, you are not a deadbeat, you were victimized.

The do's and the don'ts yet again.

Interesting. Never been one for labels but have always supposed myself to be more liberal than conservative but your summation seems to label me a conservative. Maybe I'm just plain confused. But then I've never devoted much time to debating whether I'm an agnostic or an atheist and always have to grab the dictionary to figure out which one I might be if the subject ever comes up and someone demands a definitive.

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Posted : September 12, 2014 1:24 am
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