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STTsailor
(@STTsailor)
Trusted Member

The simbiosis of Pharma, AG and gov is quite obvious. Just follow the money. The same scenario as tobacco industry. Nothing new here. It took 50 years for well known risks of tobacco to finally surface.

The big push in the 90s for opiates for chronic benign pain has ruined lives of several generations of Americans. We will be paying the price for another 50 years.

Our addiction to sugar consumption resulted in explosion of obesity and its consequences. The sugar dependence stars in early childhood. What will it take to change?

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Posted : June 26, 2016 4:05 pm
Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

The sugar dependence stars in early childhood. What will it take to change?

Keeping soda and soda machines (and the other sugar laden beverages) out of the schools is a start. I recall the only option we had to drink in school other than the water fountain came out of a cow. But that's a bit off topic.

Kids, Soda, and Obesity

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Posted : June 26, 2016 4:54 pm
janeinstx
(@janeinstx)
Trusted Member

(tu)

As soon as someone says "Big Pharma" "Big Ag" etc, I pretty much consider the rest of the words exiting their mouths or fingers utter rubbish.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 5:07 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

Again, I see many anecdotes and asertations and no citations. No one is saying there are not problems with the pharmaceutical industry in this country, much of which can be traced back to our for profit health care system and our oversight system. I'm quite sure employees and their families of "Big Pharma" feel the effects of cancer, opiate addictions and chronic disease so the idea they don't want to cure anything falls in the realm of a flat earth and chemtrails.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 6:36 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

If you read my comments, I'm in favor of plain legalization of cannabis, as well as, all drugs. The war on drugs is an abject failure. Empty the penitentiaries of drug dealers and users, tax drugs, use revenue for education, treatment, and mental health.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 6:46 pm
STTsailor
(@STTsailor)
Trusted Member

I do not think anybody is alleging a conspiracy. Conspiracy means crime. The corporations have responsibility to shareholders. They are in business to make money. They sponsor research convenient to their offering and suppress research that is not favorable to to their offering. With proper lobbying they are able to manipulate the government and keep politicians in their pockets by donating to reelection campaigns. Nothing criminal here. They buy inertia.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 7:20 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

Suppressing evidence can be criminal. Science is a method. It is constantly evolving as as new research is done. If research to the contrary of a companies' financial desires is not financed by that company, another company will. Hence how "Big Oil" (lol) cannot suppress the vast majority of evidence of man made global warming.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 7:32 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Trusted Member

Wow. A whole day of people wasting their breath over nothing.

Maybe one of you experts out there will answer one simple question:

Since the law does not provide for legally growing marijuana on each island, where do
you think it will come from? I mean specifically, HOW are you going to import it
into the VI and distribute it to a legal selling facility?

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Posted : June 26, 2016 10:31 pm
watruw8ing4
(@watruw8ing4)
Trusted Member

Maybe when this generation fully retires or kicks off, we'll see some attitude change . . .

What's the "this generation"? I'm 70. Many, many of my generation smoked hashish (in the UK MJ wasn't available back then but hash was); and when I emigrated to the US in 1968 MJ was all over the place and has been ever since. I can't relate to "this generation" having anything to do with it - but maybe being "American" does?

I'm not saying we didn't/don't do it. But I was speaking from the perspective of watching older US politicians fighting legalization every step of the way, and watching the polls gradually move toward acceptance over the years - and seeing larger numbers of the younger demographic in favor. So yeah, maybe it's a US thing.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 10:42 pm
Bombi
(@Bombi)
Trusted Member

The MMJ bill number is 31-0348. I attempted to post a link but the server at legvi.org wasn't responding. It can be found under bill tracking and yes there are provisions fr growing include in the bill's language.

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Posted : June 26, 2016 11:01 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Since the law does not provide for legally growing marijuana on each island ...

It does. See the Source article which I linked in the first post - paragraph #4.

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Topic starter Posted : June 26, 2016 11:35 pm
dougtamjj
(@dougtamjj)
Expert

I might be very wrong but it seems to me that the number one money maker on St. Croix is illegal MJ and guns. That is why we remain undeveloped and have very little tourism. The main income on the island is drugs and gun running. If it becomes legal then the big money maker goes away. Just my opinion based on observation and conversation with Crucian friends.

Tammy

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Posted : June 27, 2016 12:33 am
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Sidelining on that point, one hurdle to think about is the Federal ban on banking institutions accepting deposits from marijuana dealers (including electronic transfers/credit card transactions). Even the revenue from medical marijuana (not recreational) is likely to be comparatively substantial in our small community and any business with large amounts of cash on hand is highly vulnerable to the criminal element.
http://www.thecannabist.co/2016/04/29/marijuana-banking-woes-easing/52473/

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Topic starter Posted : June 27, 2016 10:12 am
LiquidFluoride
(@LiquidFluoride)
Trusted Member

the vast majority of evidence of man made global warming.

that was sarcastic, right?

or do you believe in THAT "theory" but not others??

These examples of "big pharma" at work aren't tin foil hat inspired , they are well documented cases.

"conspiracy" and "tinfoil hat" are very nice ways to marginalize something you don't understand or agree with; but those pejoratives have lost their power, as we find more and more that established systems must be questioned due to the inherent corruption that comes with a lack of oversight.

"power corrupts" etc..

I can't help but think those doctors were encouraged to lie to the VI gov... perhaps paid? I assume they were not under oath at the time... so I guess its ok?

Even the revenue from medical marijuana (not recreational) is likely to be comparatively substantial in our small community and any business with large amounts of cash on hand is highly vulnerable to the criminal element.

Wouldn't that just prompt more jobs? security, construction, etc?

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Posted : June 27, 2016 11:59 am
sunshinefun
(@sunshinefun)
Trusted Member

one hurdle to think about is the Federal ban on banking institutions accepting deposits from marijuana dealers (including electronic transfers/credit card transactions). Even the revenue from medical marijuana (not recreational) is likely to be comparatively substantial in our small community and any business with large amounts of cash on hand is highly vulnerable to the criminal element.

When I was a hydroponic pot grower, I never had a problem finding a way to deal with all the cash. After we spent all we could on our house (contractors love cash), we just started stacking it up in cardboard boxes. We'd deposit varying amounts of cash every week in our banks accounts via bank machines. But those were the days before people would kill you for it.

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Posted : June 27, 2016 4:36 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

the vast majority of evidence of man made global warming.

that was sarcastic, right?

or do you believe in THAT "theory" but not others??

I follow evidence. The overwhelming majority of evidence shows mankind is at least partly responsible for climate change, I won't even get into the science of vaccines with you because I know that is a dead end

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Posted : June 27, 2016 6:20 pm
sttanon
(@sttanon)
Advanced Member

I can't help but think those doctors were encouraged to lie to the VI gov... perhaps paid? I assume they were not under oath at the time... so I guess its ok?

Some of the people that testified were paid I am sure that the local Dr.s were not. If you give testimony you can be sworn in, I know several times I was.

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Posted : June 27, 2016 6:41 pm
LiquidFluoride
(@LiquidFluoride)
Trusted Member

I follow evidence. The overwhelming majority of evidence shows mankind is at least partly responsible for climate change, I won't even get into the science of vaccines with you because I know that is a dead end

Oh really? I can confidently say that there is absolutely zero evidence that humans have had any kind of effect on the global climate.

for example: where is global temperature taken? and what are the error margins? and are why is the data from all sources not considered, just specific ones?

There's a lot of effort spent to convince us that we need to be restricted because... well because they say we need to basically.

Government, it's just what they do.

one hurdle to think about is the Federal ban on banking institutions accepting deposits from marijuana dealers (including electronic transfers/credit card transactions). Even the revenue from medical marijuana (not recreational) is likely to be comparatively substantial in our small community and any business with large amounts of cash on hand is highly vulnerable to the criminal element.

When I was a hydroponic pot grower, I never had a problem finding a way to deal with all the cash. After we spent all we could on our house (contractors love cash), we just started stacking it up in cardboard boxes. We'd deposit varying amounts of cash every week in our banks accounts via bank machines. But those were the days before people would kill you for it.

Sure seems like EXACTLY the best situation possible for the VI... "cash only" will encourage the money to stay local, with contractors and the like as mentioned above.

win win?

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Posted : June 28, 2016 12:11 am
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

https://www.skepticalscience.com/empirical-evidence-for-global-warming.htm

I'm not freaking out about climate change, but it is pretty well documented.

Just think of the atmosphere when people start blazing joints in the VI *this is sarcasm*

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Posted : June 28, 2016 12:33 am
sunshinefun
(@sunshinefun)
Trusted Member

A single plant can produce as much as $14,000 worth of pot. The average grow room can hold well over 100 plants, which makes each room worth an astonishing $1,400,000+.

I had 300 plants growing in my basement...the boxes of cash grew very quickly.

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Posted : June 28, 2016 4:36 pm
speee1dy
(@speee1dy)
Expert

might want to try keeping the juices out of the lunch rooms. they have more sugar than soda

The sugar dependence stars in early childhood. What will it take to change?

Keeping soda and soda machines (and the other sugar laden beverages) out of the schools is a start. I recall the only option we had to drink in school other than the water fountain came out of a cow. But that's a bit off topic.

Kids, Soda, and Obesity

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Posted : June 28, 2016 4:40 pm
LiquidFluoride
(@LiquidFluoride)
Trusted Member

A single plant can produce as much as $14,000 worth of pot. The average grow room can hold well over 100 plants, which makes each room worth an astonishing $1,400,000+.

I had 300 plants growing in my basement...the boxes of cash grew very quickly.

I'm sure once it's legal those price points will drop drastically.

the VI is one of hte highest price point areas I've seen.. must be why "business is so good"

why we aren't tapping into that and making it legit is far beyond me.

But I guess it is cool to see hybusa's in the projects.... right?

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Posted : June 28, 2016 7:27 pm
stxdreamer
(@stxdreamer)
Advanced Member

I posted my feelings on this subject during a previous discussion re marijuana on the islands. For the sake of this current discussion, I'd like to post it again, as I do believe it is the way of the future:

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stxdreamer
Here are my thoughts on this subject coming from a background of 3 years as a Special Agent, FBI, 15 years as a state prosecutor, and 19 years as a trial court judge. Having dealt extensively with marijuana issues during all of that time, I strongly support the legalization of marijuana for all purposes, not just medical.

Law enforcement efforts against marijuana consume an inordinate amount of scarce resources available to the legal system for what is essentially a victimless crime. In my state (Kentucky) we spend 60-70 percent of the court system's resources on marijuana related crimes. Ridiculous. And remember, Kentucky is a state that prides itself on being a leading producer of tobacco and alcohol products, along with legalized gambling (horse racing). We are a Sin state with a capital S.

I can think of no valid arguments against the use of medical marijuana, and quite frankly, imho, marijuana use is no worse than smoking a cigarette or drinking a beer or shot of bourbon. In addition, the well-to-do already self-medicate themselves via the aid of friendly physicians.

Governments need to stop this insane persecution of marijuana and instead devote their resources where they are really needed. The continued criminalization of marijuana makes no sense to me whatsoever. The benefits of decriminalization are obvious: 1) eliminates undue law enforcement burden and makes resources available to deal with serious crime; 2) new opportunities for economic growth and tax revenues for government, including tourism benefits; and 3) eliminates the need to make criminals out of so many of our young people. Finally, the benefits of medical marijuana will be available without the worry or shame of using it.

Disclaimer: I have never used an illegal drug, or even smoked a cigarette. I do enjoy a nightly round of bourbon, however (my drug of choice).

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Posted : June 28, 2016 7:47 pm
rotorhead
(@rotorhead)
Trusted Member

stxdreamer. (tu)

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Posted : June 28, 2016 8:16 pm
pilatesgal318
(@pilatesgal318)
Advanced Member

Excellent post, stxdreamer!

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Posted : June 28, 2016 8:36 pm
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