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Tibbar Energy ????

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ms411
(@ms411)
Expert

IMO, every household should have a home garden to supplement store purchases and for access to fresh produce with some edible produce grown indoors. One of the elementary schools on St Thomas has a thriving garden and sells plants during food fair, which is a great program exposing the kids to gardens.

I support personal, not commercial, agriculture for the VI.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 12:06 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

I grow my own okra, tomatoes, bitter melon, papaya, coconuts, guava berry, passion fruit, avocado, 10 or so herbs, ginger, galangal, peppers, and have a composter for all of my veggie wastes. Also a dozen pineapples (waiting for the next one to bloom). Oh, banana's too, of course.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 2:44 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

What's galangal?
Sounds like a nice garden.

I've got cashew, soursop, banana, avocado, passion fruit, coconut, Suriname cherry, lemon, lime papaya and orange trees.
I grow herbs, sweet and hot peppers, lettuce and spinach but the bugs here are tough, especially the mealy bugs, black, blight and spider mites. I seem to grow tomatoes for the thrushies.

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Topic starter Posted : December 28, 2014 3:48 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

Also have surinam cherry, barbados cherry, sour orange. My lime and tangerine just died from the whiskey mold. So did my guava.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 5:52 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

IMO, every household should have a home garden to supplement store purchases and for access to fresh produce with some edible produce grown indoors. One of the elementary schools on St Thomas has a thriving garden and sells plants during food fair, which is a great program exposing the kids to gardens.

I support personal, not commercial, agriculture for the VI.

This!

I will be starting container gardening soon. I will never grow enough to be self sufficient but I will supplement

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Posted : December 28, 2014 7:06 pm
ms411
(@ms411)
Expert

UVI on both islands offers hydroponics workshops next year for a fee and for anybody who's interested. The topic is one of their research projects, I guess. Very interesting reading.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 7:18 pm
LiquidFluoride
(@LiquidFluoride)
Trusted Member

UVI on both islands offers hydroponics workshops next year for a fee and for anybody who's interested. The topic is one of their research projects, I guess. Very interesting reading.

Seems like a strange project given our electric costs here.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 8:21 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

Have a large, prolific mango tree, too. Just planted a star fruit/ carombola tree and have a bunch of papaya trees ready to be put
in the ground. I'd like to put some guava trees in this year, too.

What's galangal?

Guess we sidetracked from TIBBAR:-o

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Topic starter Posted : December 28, 2014 8:30 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

A type of ginger. Milder more earthy taste.

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Posted : December 28, 2014 8:34 pm
Chuck C
(@Chuck_C)
Active Member

What ever happened to these guys, My friend the radio host told me that the Smiths left the island? Did the project ever get off the ground or was it just a big bunch of hot air?

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Posted : April 13, 2015 9:48 pm
vicanuck
(@vicanuck)
Expert

Tibbar is still around and on track to begin energy production in Dec 2015. They recently had a group of investors on island looking into the opportunity. I'm not really a fan of Tibbar, but I think they will be successful.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 11:03 am
RUMDRNKR
(@RUMDRNKR)
Active Member

Are you as confident as the the ABR deal?

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Posted : April 14, 2015 11:52 am
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

Ye gads! I thought they had gone away when they were not granted the lease by the VI Legislature for the land they wanted.

Updated: V.I. Legislature Rejects Tibbar Energy Lease
BY BILL KOSSLER — DECEMBER 24, 2014
Correction: See Editor's Note

The V.I. Government will not rent hundreds of acres of St. Croix farmland to Tibbar Energy to grow King Grass for use in electricity production after the V.I. Legislature voted to reject the measure Friday. The Legislature first voted to approve the lease, then later recalled the question and voted to reject it, while acting on a number of other leases, rezonings and board nominations before the Senate on Friday. The government had planned to lease Tibbar 232 acres on St. Croix that are reserved for agricultural use to grow King Grass. The land would have joined more than 1,700 acres on St. Croix that Tibbar has purchased or leased to grow the grass and build digesters to produce biogas for energy production, according to Tibbar owner and manager Tania Tomyn.

Senators raised concerns about the length of the lease and use of groundwater that hypothetically could be needed by farmers. Agriculture officals testified in committee in support of the project. After the initial vote in favor of the lease, Sen. Donald Cole called for the bill to be reconsidered. On the second vote, Cole and Sen. Alicia "Chucky" Hansen changed from yes to not voting and Sen. Shawn-Michael Malone changed from yes to no, killing the lease.

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Topic starter Posted : April 14, 2015 12:15 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

As noted, they already had a LOT of land they purchased or leased from private owners and the government land was only a very small portion of the whole.

I did a bit of research after initially thinking it was probably not a good project and changed my mind after reading many pros and cons.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 1:24 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

A few things to remember.

Invasive grass species that is already a huge problem in FL.
Large amounts of water needed from dwindling local aquifer supplies.
Miniscule amount of energy produced while using vast amount of local resources while risking uncontrolled spreading of said invasive grass.

Not to mention lack of track record or history of success in prior projects such as this by principals, the shady pasts of at least 2 of
the principals.

This is another "pie in the sky" deal such as Alpine was.
Carlton Dowe's track record isn't so hot, either.

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Topic starter Posted : April 14, 2015 2:00 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

Are you as confident as the the ABR deal?

So how are we better off financially by NOT approving the ABR deal?

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Posted : April 14, 2015 2:10 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

A few things to remember.

Large amounts of water needed from dwindling local aquifer supplies.

Garbage. We have no dwindling water supply here on STX. Can you support your statement with any scientific evidence?

And I know that you are smart enough to know how that aquifer is
replenished. Most of the water pumped from the ground and used to water a plant goes right back into the aquifer.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 2:14 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Garbage. We have no dwindling water supply here on STX. Can you support your statement with any scientific evidence?

Have to agree there. Unlike in CA where there are very serious water issues, we DO get plenty of rain consistently so any argument based on that is hollow. And many (educated) reports I remember reading disputed the grass in question being negatively invasive and in fact said it was easily controlled. Guess I'll have to go back to my research if I'm asked for citations!

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Posted : April 14, 2015 2:37 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext5.html
http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext1.html

There's more info if you wish to Google it, yourself.

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Topic starter Posted : April 14, 2015 2:48 pm
CruzanIron
(@cruzaniron)
Expert

http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext5.html
http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext1.html

There's more info if you wish to Google it, yourself.

Nothing in that report supports your claim that the supplies are dwindling.

I had to laugh at the inaccuracy of this part of the report

Most of the water withdrawn is mixed with seawater and used to feed desalination plants for public supply.

And the data is also over 25 years old.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 3:05 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext5.html
http://pubs.usgs.gov/ha/ha730/ch_n/N-PR_VItext1.html

There's more info if you wish to Google it, yourself.

I'm less interested in a geological breakdown of the groundwater in the USVI than in something more tangible as it relates to utilizing some of it in the cultivation of this species of grass. That's what I looked at several months ago and know where to look again. 😀

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Posted : April 14, 2015 3:11 pm
Spartygrad95
(@Spartygrad95)
Trusted Member

Also where is it listed as invasive? The USDA doesn't list it that I could find. Most bunch type grasses are very slow to encroach. This grass also produces a sterile seed I read.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 3:20 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

Yes, data is old, and population has grown as has water usage since then.

Didn't I hear you guys in STX, recently, bemoaning the fact you've
not had much precipitation?

Can you guarantee that future rainfall amounts will keep your aquifers healthy?

"The principal recharge to the Kingshill aquifer is from infiltration of an estimated 3 percent of the precipitation that falls on the aquifer and is not lost to evapotranspiration. Some recharge also is from streams, especially during periods of storm runoff, when the altitude of the water in the stream is above that of the water table. Some water from runoff of the Northside Range may enter the aquifer at its contact with the volcaniclastic and sedimentary rocks. Water readily moves into the permeable alluvium and into fractures in the marl and limestone."

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Topic starter Posted : April 14, 2015 3:24 pm
Alana33
(@alana33)
Expert

Also where is it listed as invasive? The USDA doesn't list it that I could find. Most bunch type grasses are very slow to encroach. This grass also produces a sterile seed I read.

Napier, or Elephant Grass (Pennisetum purpureum) and its Invasive Potential in the VI

Gary Ray, Ph.D., Virgin Forest Restorations, 9901 Emmaus, St. John, VI 00830

Summary:
I was asked to provide my professional judgment as a plant ecologist and VI floristic expert of the risks involved in introducing a known noxious pest to the VI as a target species to produce bioenergy. In my professional opinion, there is a high likelihood that Elephant grass will become a widespread nuisance at least, or agricultural nightmare at most, once introduced here. Plant ecologists in Florida would surely corroborate this opinion.

Introduction
Napier grass, also known as Elephant grass, Giant king grass, and other monikers (Pennisetum purpureum), is a clump-forming grass that can reach 12-15 feet in height, particularly near shorelines (UFL Center of Exotic and Invasive Plants 2013; HEAR 2004). The species was introduced from Africa to Florida in the early 20th century as a
forage grass. This species is presently one of Florida’s most noxious weedy pests.

Invasive Potential
Managers of waterways in Florida are losing the battle to control or eradicate this weed in canal banks, agricultural settings, and other disturbed areas from wet to dry soils. Once established the plant self propagates vegetatively by rhizomes, stem fragments and root
crown divisions (Global Compendium of Weeds; FAO Weed Management). It has a deep fibrous root system that allows it to resist drought. In agricultural areas the plant is known to reduce yields, increase agricultural production costs, and can become a massive problems for home gardeners seeking to supplement their food budget. As the plant spreads, it can block roadside culverts, impeding channelized water flow.

Invasiveness of this species is well known in Florida, but it has only recently been seen in Puerto Rico, and plans exist to introduce it to St. Croix to produce bioenergy. Details of dispersal, establishment and ecological impacts can only be predicted Therefore, it is an “incipient” invasive exotic, with extraordinary potential to become a widespread noxious weed – its windborne seeds certain to germinate in every roadside culvert and depression with standing water across the island, then spread to other islands by any of several typical invasion pathways. Once highly invasive plant species are introduced,
there are few options for subsequent eradication as the plant spreads to unintended locations.

References:
[plants.ifas.ufl.edu]
[plants.ifas.ufl.edu]

Parsons, W.T. and Cuthbertson, E.G. (1992). Noxious Weeds of Australia. Inkata Press, Melbourne & Sydney
Information Sources:

1. Identification and Biology of Nonnative Plants in Florida’s Natural Areas –
Second Edition, by K.A. Langeland, H.M. Cherry, et al. University of Florida-IFAS Publication # SP 257. 2008.

2. Strangers in Paradise, Impact and Management of Nonindigenous Species in Florida, Gary Ray, Ph.D., Virgin Forest Restorations, 9901 Emmaus, St. John, VI 00830
Chapter 2: Florida’s Invasion by Nonindigenous Plants: History, Screening, and Regulation, by D.R. Gordon and K.P. Thomas, pp. 21-37. Island Press, Washington, DC,
1997.

3. Integrated Management of Nonnative Plants in Natural Areas of Florida, by K. A. Langeland, J. A. Ferrell, B. Sellers, G. E. MacDonald, and R. K. Stocker. University of Florida-IFAS Publication # SP 242. 2011.

Exotic Plant Lists:
Florida Exotic Plant Pest Council – lists this species among non-native and invasive exotic plants for this region
Global Invasive Species Database – four close relatives on this list
Hawaii Ecosystems at Risk (HEAR) – listed this species as problematic in Hawaii

Gary Ray, Ph.D., Virgin Forest Restorations, 9901 Emmaus, St. John, VI 00830

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Topic starter Posted : April 14, 2015 3:52 pm
OldTart
(@the-oldtart)
Expert

Yes, data is old, and population has grown as has water usage since then.

Negligible. The 1980 census reported STX population at 49,725 and in 2010 as 50,601.

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Posted : April 14, 2015 3:52 pm
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