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Plastic Bag Ban

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Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

whats wrong with biodegradable plastic bags?

I posted this before but you might've missed it:

http://www.sciencefocus.com/qa/how-long-do-biodegradable-bags-take-decompose

Biodegradable plastics take three to six months to decompose fully. That’s much quicker than synthetic counterparts that take several hundred years. Exactly how long a biodegradable bag takes to break down depends on various factors, such as temperature and the amount of moisture present.

But the bags aren’t always as environmentally friendly as they seem. They’re made from similar petrochemical-based materials to conventional plastic, only with compounds added that cause them to disintegrate gradually in the presence of light or oxygen.
They often then degrade into a sludge of toxic chemicals.

Bioplastics made of cornstarch and other plant-based materials are a better bet. They give off CO2 as they decompose, but they’re merely expelling carbon locked in by the plant matter that originally formed them. The net effect on the environment is therefore close to zero.

Biodegradable plastics are still going to cause the same issues for the wildlife in those 3-6 months. Don't make for good turtle food.

I'd like to see the stores offer good ol'fashion biodegradable paper bags for those that forget to bring there own. Hawaii has done that. If they can't swallow the cost then maybe they need to charge a few pennies for them.

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Posted : April 19, 2017 3:28 pm
Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

Pretty sad they can't even get this law right. There are enough municipalities out there they have a ban already, why not use their law as a guide to make sure it clears all legal challenges? These senators are a waste of payroll.

They probably could have cloned Hawaii's legislation but then some local lobbyist probably wouldn't have gotten paid.

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Posted : April 19, 2017 3:40 pm
Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

thanks alana.

i wonder why nothing is being done about all the plastic water and soda bottles on island that i see littering the roads? seems that would be a top priority too

Also in stthomassource.com

"Unlike the bottle deposit and source separation and recycling bills that the Authority is turning its attention to next, the plastic bag ban is a logical first step toward waste reduction."

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Posted : April 19, 2017 3:51 pm
stxsailor
(@stxsailor)
Trusted Member

The BVI was able to do this without all this drama from store owners and residents.

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Topic starter Posted : April 19, 2017 4:45 pm
Alana33
(@Alana33)
Expert

Heck, when I spent time in Vermont, Mt. Snow area, in the early 70s, you'd pay a deposit on cans and bottles. When you returned them to the stores, you got your money back.

If they didn't get returned and tossed on roadsides, school groups and other groups, homeless or others would pick them up and use the money for their needs. I think the deposits at that time were 5 -10¢ per can, bottles, etc.

It's hard to comprehend the level of self-serving ineptitude and ignorance that goes on here.

Anyone remember when VIWMA spent $1MILLION DOLLARS on a study to tax everything that came in at full weight and got shot down by PSC due to the huge public outcry and chaos that it would've created in customs clearance?

They could've googled recycling and come up with a better plan following tried and true, successful recycling programs in other locations around the world but that would've entailed actually doing the work themselves.

Oh, then there's the $60K conveyor belt machine some moron at WMA purchased that ended up sitting in the dump, rusting away because it was the wrong thing.

VI Waste Mismanagement Authority doesn't manage waste.
They manage contracts for waste haulers who then build multi MILLION dollar homes that Mapp can pay $12.5 Thousand Dollars a month to rent in a fancy neighborhood.

Don't get me started.
I testified at that PSC hearing and it was standing room only.

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Posted : April 19, 2017 5:34 pm
NugBlazer
(@NugBlazer)
Advanced Member

Think about this fact: EVERY piece of plastic that has EVER been made is still in existence. Every. Single. One. Plastic never, EVER goes away.

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Posted : April 19, 2017 6:10 pm
Scubadoo
(@Scubadoo)
Trusted Member

Think about this fact: EVERY piece of plastic that has EVER been made is still in existence. Every. Single. One. Plastic never, EVER goes away.

But it can be made into useful things that don't need to go away, My deck is made from recycled milk cartons. So is the C'sted boardwalk.

If they start requiring a bottle deposit/pay back program the remaining shopping carts will all disappear.

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Posted : April 19, 2017 9:07 pm
gringojj
(@gringojj)
Advanced Member

Apparently the start of the bag ban has been changed to sometime in August. Also plaza west in stx no longer has baggers apparently. I went today and brought my own bags, but the cashier told me that if i wanted to use my own bags id have to bag my purchases myself. I cant unload my cart, watch my items get scanned to verify the price, and bag my purchases, all at the same time so I had to go with plastic bags today. Im not sure whats going on over there.

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Posted : June 2, 2017 7:03 pm
rosesisland
(@rosesisland)
Trusted Member

Apparently the start of the bag ban has been changed to sometime in August. Also plaza west in stx no longer has baggers apparently. I went today and brought my own bags, but the cashier told me that if i wanted to use my own bags id have to bag my purchases myself. I can't unload my cart, watch my items get scanned to verify the price, and bag my purchases, all at the same time so I had to go with plastic bags today. Im not sure whats going on over there.

Why Plaza West removed the end caps of the checkout because of the band is beyond me. Don't we need to "stage" our groceries as we put them in our bags? It bothers me so much so, I only shop there now for a certain few items I cannot get elsewhere. I only buy now what will fill just one bag. The hassle of not being able to seperate my items before bagging and watch the scanner, I find it just too much.

For awhile there was one checkout lane left with the end cap, but, alas, now that one has been removed. I've complained, but, to no avail. Maybe if more complain, they'll bring them back.

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Posted : June 3, 2017 7:34 am
stjohnjulie
(@stjohnjulie)
Trusted Member

Shortly before the ban St. John Market and Dolphin Markets had upgraded and got the bagging carousels at their checkouts. They still have them, but Dolphin Market has a larger carousel and they don't bag, they just put your stuff all over the carousel. It's a pain in the butt. I use my bag when I shop, when it's full, I'm done. But when I shop, all the heavy stuff goes in first, things that get swished go on top, so when I check out the opposite is true so I have to just wait until they finish scanning and then put it all in and be in the way. St. John Market is much better. They wait until I have my stuff unloaded, take my bag, then check out items heaviest to lightest and load my bag. I haven't seen a plastic bag at any of the grocery stores on St.John since before the ban. And I don't see nearly as may of them on the ground any more which is nice. But I did have to buy little garbage bags for bathroom garbage cans since I always used the plastic bags I got while grocery shopping.

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Posted : June 3, 2017 8:19 am
Treeman
(@Treeman)
Advanced Member

, watch my items get scanned to verify the price,.

Is that a necessity in USVI? Are the scanners, registers and software ever inspected or tested by the government for accuracy?

Which stores are the least accurate in your experience?

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Posted : June 3, 2017 10:59 am
singlefin
(@singlefin)
Trusted Member

I'm sorry, but really???
I can't believe all the whining here about grocery bags. Bring bags, plastic bags, paper bags, how to bag, who bags,
WHO CARES!

One good hurricane and every loose piece of debris on the island ends up in the sea. Watch the streets turn into rivers after a heavy rain and watch a log flow of crap head for the beach. We've got sewage leaking into our hospital. Abandon boats half sunk and leaking fuel all over the place. God only knows what all those cruise ship discharge.

Certainly grocery bags are the least of our environmental problems.

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Posted : June 3, 2017 11:16 am
gringojj
(@gringojj)
Advanced Member

, watch my items get scanned to verify the price,.

Is that a necessity in USVI? Are the scanners, registers and software ever inspected or tested by the government for accuracy?

Which stores are the least accurate in your experience?

I think thats everywhere not just the usvi. Sometimes saie items do not ring up at the sale price. You should always watch what stuff is ringing up at. Unfortunately when something rings up wrong its quite a fiasco.

I actually was not able to watch yesterday as I had alot of items to unload.

The lack of end table things is really a problem. There is not much space at the end of the register. When I tried to give her the bags I brought there was actually no place to put them to bag my groceries anyway. The area was already full of my stuff. Idk the whole thing is very inefficient.

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Posted : June 3, 2017 11:24 am
ms411
(@ms411)
Expert

You need to watch the scanner so you know what the prices are. Very few things are marked either individually or on the shelf so the only way to know and compare is to watch the scanner.

If price doesn't matter please feel free to ignore the scanner.

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Posted : June 3, 2017 2:08 pm
speee1dy
(@speee1dy)
Expert

just bag your stuff after it has all been scanned and you are ready to pay

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Posted : June 6, 2017 10:50 am
gringojj
(@gringojj)
Advanced Member

just bag your stuff after it has all been scanned and you are ready to pay

If you have alot of stuff you cant because you are limited to the space at the end of the station. That area fills up quickly. In order to do what you propose you would have to unload onto the belt, tell the cashier to not start scanning yet, then go over to the monitor and tell her to start scanning, watch your items scan, then when the area fills up tell her to stop, bag up your groceries, then tell her to start again, watch again, tell her to stop, bag again.....you get the idea

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Posted : June 6, 2017 11:11 am
speee1dy
(@speee1dy)
Expert

if i were that concerned i would wait. but i have had cashiers bag my stuff in my bags at some stores.

just bag your stuff after it has all been scanned and you are ready to pay

If you have alot of stuff you cant because you are limited to the space at the end of the station. That area fills up quickly. In order to do what you propose you would have to unload onto the belt, tell the cashier to not start scanning yet, then go over to the monitor and tell her to start scanning, watch your items scan, then when the area fills up tell her to stop, bag up your groceries, then tell her to start again, watch again, tell her to stop, bag again.....you get the idea

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Posted : June 6, 2017 1:10 pm
gringojj
(@gringojj)
Advanced Member

if i were that concerned i would wait. but i have had cashiers bag my stuff in my bags at some stores.

Yee the cashier did bag my items, in plastic bags though. I had brought my own bags but she told me if i wanted them in my own bags id have to bag myself. She would only bag my stuff in plastic bags

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Posted : June 6, 2017 1:42 pm
stxsailor
(@stxsailor)
Trusted Member

The wastefulness on bags is ridiculous. Too many times i see people but a can of coke and ask for a bag. Really you must just want to make trash for the purpose of making trash.

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Topic starter Posted : June 6, 2017 5:31 pm
speee1dy
(@speee1dy)
Expert

thats just stupidity on their part

if i were that concerned i would wait. but i have had cashiers bag my stuff in my bags at some stores.

Yee the cashier did bag my items, in plastic bags though. I had brought my own bags but she told me if i wanted them in my own bags id have to bag myself. She would only bag my stuff in plastic bags

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Posted : June 6, 2017 5:49 pm
sjointer
(@sjointer)
Advanced Member

Okay...do I need to purchase a bunch of canvas bags before I leave?

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Posted : June 9, 2017 5:57 am
stjohnjulie
(@stjohnjulie)
Trusted Member

You can if you want to, but most of the stores sell them if you want to pick them up here. The grocery stores on STJ sell them for $4 or $5. And not sure if any of the stores on STX do anything like this, but STJ Market gives you a 10% discount if you use their bag and spend $50 or more.

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Posted : June 9, 2017 6:14 am
islandjoan
(@islandjoan)
Trusted Member

The canvas bags don't hold up well because the handles are wimpy and break. When you are here, go to the Blue Mutt in Christiansted and buy some envirosax bags. Another store in Christiansted called Adorn sells the Baggu brand. Both are similar-made of rip stop nylon and they are also super cute. Check out the websites for these brands, and also check out the two stores I mentioned-they both have Facebook pages.

Okay...do I need to purchase a bunch of canvas bags before I leave?

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Posted : June 9, 2017 10:13 am
AandA2VI
(@AandA2VI)
Trusted Member

I'm sorry, but really???
I can't believe all the whining here about grocery bags. Bring bags, plastic bags, paper bags, how to bag, who bags,
WHO CARES!

One good hurricane and every loose piece of debris on the island ends up in the sea. Watch the streets turn into rivers after a heavy rain and watch a log flow of crap head for the beach. We've got sewage leaking into our hospital. Abandon boats half sunk and leaking fuel all over the place. God only knows what all those cruise ship discharge.

Certainly grocery bags are the least of our environmental problems.

Yea who cares. Wait aren't you a surfer????! :O

Not that this planet isn't already doomed from all the pollution you mentioned but why say who cares when it's such an easy thing - to just not use them. Our ocean is F-ed.
I personally have zero hope that it will rebound and since it produces 70%+ of the earths oxygen, well.. yea. I believe that 100yr estimate: especially with so many people who have zero interest (education) in trying to make a difference.

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Posted : June 10, 2017 3:41 pm
AandA2VI
(@AandA2VI)
Trusted Member

Also fwiw - ADORN in STX in csted has awesome high quality canvas bags that I designed 😉 they wash well and are solid construction. We stuff ours full of heave heavy groceries.

http://www.adornstcroix.com/bags/products/st-croix-tote-bag

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Posted : June 11, 2017 5:08 am
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