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rotorhead
(@rotorhead)
Trusted Member

At least we have a governor we can be proud of. Too bad the senate and constitutional convention are such an embarrassments.

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Posted : June 11, 2009 9:40 pm
DUN
 DUN
(@DUN)
Trusted Member

Test post

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Posted : June 12, 2009 12:48 am
DUN
 DUN
(@DUN)
Trusted Member

This is what happens when you have Adel brain (from the word Adele, which means liquid manure)M(for Murder).
Writing anything!

In the words of my cousin Vinny, "Everything that guy just said is bul11$heet"!

From a reliable local source,his grandmother was from Antigua, so Bert, you go back where you came from you garret mudda scu...

He is one of many who seek to divide!

Kudos for the Governor for his wisdom & shielding the world from this racist,childish piece of crap.
We have been embarrassed enough!

Hopefully,the rest of the world wont find out what kind of political idiots we have here!(OKI HOPE)

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Posted : June 12, 2009 12:51 am
A Davis
(@A_Davis)
Trusted Member

Governor Makes Determination Regarding Proposed Constitution

http://www.governordejongh.com/news/archive/2009/06/061109-1.htm

you can listen to the news conference there as well.

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Posted : June 12, 2009 11:50 am
Bombi
(@Bombi)
Trusted Member

cruzan confusion

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Posted : June 12, 2009 12:48 pm
terry
(@terry)
Expert

Three cheers for the Governor!

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Posted : June 12, 2009 1:33 pm
glynnswife
(@glynnswife)
Advanced Member

Daily News printed the constitution in the paper today. Will be interesting to see how things develop or not.

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Posted : June 12, 2009 6:07 pm
Linda J
(@Linda_J)
Expert

As I understand it, the Governor has the last word and he spoke yesterday. 2 years and lots of money wasted!

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Posted : June 12, 2009 7:49 pm
Trade
(@Trade)
Expert

Money that could have been used in the schools, I might add.

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Posted : June 12, 2009 8:02 pm
no0ne
(@no0ne)
Advanced Member

deJongh is the man.

http://www.virginislandsdailynews.com/index.pl/article_home?id=17636737

FTA: "According to the draft, ancestral native Virgin Islanders are people who can trace their bloodlines back to people who were living in the Virgin Islands before 1932 - when the United States granted mass citizenship on people in the territory - and were not citizens of any other country. Native Virgin Islanders are defined as people who can trace their ancestry to people born in the territory after 1932.

The proposed constitution affords those groups with exclusive rights:

- Ancestral native Virgin Islanders would get generous property tax abatements - they would pay no taxes on their primary residences or undeveloped land.

- Only ancestral and native Virgin Islanders could be elected governor or lieutenant governor.

- Only ancestral and native Virgin Islanders could vote on changing the territory's political status in relation to the United States."

FTA: deJongh said, "Surely no one should expect me - one of only three African-American governors in our nation and, by the way, a native and ancestral Virgin Islander - to forward a proposed constitution that is clearly unconstitutional to our nation's first African-American president, who happens to also be a constitutional scholar and a former law professor," deJongh said. "A man, incidentally, who even though he has been elected to our nation's highest office, would be ineligible to run for governor or lieutenant governor of this U.S. territory no matter how many years he lived here under the terms of this proposed draft."

As a partial Mohawk (grandfather is half) I do not see the right for any person today to be owed reparations or entitlement for anything for what their grandfather (or elder) had to go through. I owe nothing to anyone for what my lineage did, no matter if it is European or otherwise. What this is, is nothing less than racism. Racism in any form is wrong. No questions asked.

/grandfather road the busses and risked his life in Selma, Alabama for equal rights for all
//he and my mother were called n!ggers because of their dark skin
///voted for Obama, and will in 2012!

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Posted : June 13, 2009 1:05 am
no0ne
(@no0ne)
Advanced Member

Going back through old posts in this thread...

So there are no white locals, hmmmmmmmmmm.

I also know the truth, and I even know many white locals!

The Frenchi's don't consider themselves to be white or West Indian.

/last time I was there I "insulted" quite a few Frenchi friends by telling them they were West Indian, by definition
//fortunately they consider me as one of their own, even though I am a Continental
///know many of Continental decent that were born on the island

i am not even certain that the people who decided to twist that lyric were doing it in support of anyone in particular, or just operating from their own discontent.

(concerning "White Rabbit)

It happened in early 1987. There was major discord from Juan Luis leaving office. Would you like for me to tell you, as I was there, things that I experienced? You would not like one description I have, from being a white boy who was traveling with the Daily News editor's wife and daughter - who are West Indian.

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Posted : June 13, 2009 2:17 am
A Davis
(@A_Davis)
Trusted Member

Going back through old posts in this thread...

So there are no white locals, hmmmmmmmmmm.

I also know the truth, and I even know many white locals!

The Frenchi's don't consider themselves to be white or West Indian.

/last time I was there I "insulted" quite a few Frenchi friends by telling them they were West Indian, by definition
//fortunately they consider me as one of their own, even though I am a Continental
///know many of Continental decent that were born on the island

i am not even certain that the people who decided to twist that lyric were doing it in support of anyone in particular, or just operating from their own discontent.

(concerning "White Rabbit)

It happened in early 1987. There was major discord from Juan Luis leaving office. Would you like for me to tell you, as I was there, things that I experienced? You would not like one description I have, from being a white boy who was traveling with the Daily News editor's wife and daughter - who are West Indian.

no0ne, you are welcome to share your experiences here, it's a forum.

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Posted : June 13, 2009 3:01 am
Edward
(@Edward)
Trusted Member

Earlier in this thread, I said, "So many problems!" I was confident this document, if it were ratified (big if!) could not be defended against Constitutional challenges based on the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment.

Comes now the Attorney General, who advises the Governor, "Legal counsel to the Convention made it clear that such provisions were not consistent with the United States Constitution."

With some 20 years of teaching Constitutional Law (and having taken an oath twice to support and defend the Constitution of the United States of America, once as an Army officer and again as a Peace Corps Volunteer), I must commend the Governor for a superb statement and for being true to his oath.

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Posted : June 13, 2009 7:25 am
jumbiemom
(@jumbiemom)
Active Member

Being a resident of the great state of Illinois, I have great experience in what a really BAD governor is and Gov deJongh is someone we should all be proud of. This document is racism, pure and simple and in this great time when America elected Barack Obama to be our president, the delegates who spew this kind of racism should be embarrassed. Thank god for our governor - he had the courage and principles to do the right thing. Who did they think they were kidding with this?????? As always I say that voting Virgin Islanders need to send their own message when it comes time to elect new representative. I keep praying for the day that the old cronies who have had the legislature by the throat for so many years get voted out of office and some new, dedicated public servants come in and make the territory the sparkling jewel it deserves to be.

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Posted : June 13, 2009 1:16 pm
no0ne
(@no0ne)
Advanced Member

A Davis
no0ne, you are welcome to share your experiences here, it's a forum.

I am sorry for bringing this back up. I do not want to share this experience. I do not like to talk about violence that happened. There are many good West Indians, and these few that sought to soil a good song that made it's debut during 1987 do not represent a true West Indian.

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Posted : June 13, 2009 4:10 pm
JE
 JE
(@je)
Advanced Member

I do not think that Adelbert Bryan is as much of an isolated, out of the mainstream, extremist as many of us would like to think that he is. He received more votes (about 30%) than any other delegate, and I doubt that anyone who voted for him did not realize what his primary agenda was or did not share his core beliefs. I also doubt that very few Caucasians voted for him, making the percentage of West Indian voters supporting him even higher than 30%. In addition, I suspect that he has an even larger following among non-registered voters. So the most disappointing thing to me about the whole thing is that it is a pretty good indication of just how large a percentage of the population here evidently views me, based strictly on the color of my skin, as an undesirable outsider who is directly or indirectly responsible for whatever social and economic ills exist here in the USVI.

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Posted : June 14, 2009 4:16 pm
A Davis
(@A_Davis)
Trusted Member

je:

the antipathy that you describe is not necessarily tied to the idea that the self-determination of these islands should be in the hands of those who never got it.

when the islands were transferred from denmark, only the Danes were permitted to choose their citizenship, and several years later, the "inhabitants" were conferred with u.s. citizenship but there was never any choice for them. over time, the u.s. influence has grown, but that does not take away the fact that the choice was never there.

here is the article covering the inhabitants vs. the Danish residents at the time of the transfer, from the transfer document:

Article 6.

Danish citizens residing in said islands may remain therein or may remove therefrom at will, retaining in either event all their rights of property, including the right to sell or dispose of such property or its proceeds; in case they remain in the Islands, they shall continue until otherwise provided, to enjoy all the private, municipal and religious rights and liberties secured to them by the laws now in force. If the present laws are altered, the said inhabitants shall not thereby be placed in a less favorable position in respect to the above mentioned rights and liberties than they now enjoy. Those who remain in the islands may preserve their citizenship in Denmark by making before a court of record, within one year from the date of the exchange of ratifications of this convention, a declaration of their decision to preserve such citizenship; in default of which declaration they shall be held to have renounced it, and to have accepted citizenship in the United States; for children under eighteen years the said declaration may be made by their parents or guardians. Such election of Danish citizenship shall however not, after the lapse of the said term of one year, be a bar to their renunciation of their preserved Danish citizenship and their election of citizenship in the United States and admission to the nationality thereof on the same terms as may be provided according to the laws of the United States, for other inhabitants of the islands.

The civil rights and the political status of the inhabitants of the islands shall be determined by the Congress, subject to the stipulations contained in the present convention.

Danish citizens not residing in the islands but owning property therein at the time of the cession, shall retain their rights of property, including the right to sell or dispose of such property, being placed in this regard on the same basis as the Danish citizens residing in the islands and remaining therein or removing therefrom, to whom the first paragraph of this article relates.

http://uniset.ca/other/cs6/39Stat1706.html

not all virgin islanders who are for the "native/ancestral" privileges dislike anyone else, they just want their chance to decide as people whose ancestors did not have any choices in being brought from where they were, planted here, and when emancipated, in on position to have done anything with their freedom. in the u.s., the "black laws" and "jim crow" kept blacks down - even with the support of those who did not agree with this post-slavery subjugation and the kkk, a black person had no money and no power except in rare cases back then.

so, now that this comes around, there are those who feel that justice has been delayed, but does not have to be denied. they do not hate others because of their skin, but they do feel that this is a decision for those who are affected, and their descendants.

i really think that the status issue should have been decided before this one, as the "supreme law of the land" must be the u.s. constitution according to the law that governs the fifth constitutional convention. the governor feels that the delegates failed to produce a qualifying document, as the eventual submittal violates both local and federal law in terms of u.s. constitutional law and the rights and privileges of all citizens.

i am not in any of the so-called proposed privileged groups. but i am gaining a slow understanding of some things that complicate the issue more than may be apparent.

i'd like to help bring more discussion and enlightenment on this issue, and hope that i do it justice along the way.

*edited to clarify Danes receiving options*
*edited to introduce the idea that the status issue should have come before this attempt at creating a constitution with the issues at hand being the dominating factors*

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Posted : June 15, 2009 1:57 am
dntw8up
(@dntw8up)
Trusted Member

People and countries have been bought and sold, won and lost, enslaved and freed, for as long as man has been on Earth, and people have been forced to adapt. With respect to local politics, Carib, Arawak, Taino etc. and perhaps even some Europeans, could make more compelling ancestral status claims than West Indians descended from Africans, as those other populations were here first, and in the case of Indians were forced from the land. It is unfortunate that West Indians of African descent don't find adequate the benefits they derive from the suffering of their ancestors. Because their ancestors were sold by their kin and brought here as slaves, these descendants enjoy potable water on tap, public sewer systems that help prevent disease, sufficient food, childhood immunizations so children have greater opportunity to live to adulthood, voting rights, public education, and the literacy that makes it possible to complain electronically and in print about one's lot in life. In essence, having been sold and bought has resulted in the descendants of slaves having privileges most Africans without a family history of slavery can only dream of, and yet these ancestors want more privileges, special ones that their neighbors from down island or the states don't enjoy. Though not uncommon, it still boggles my mind when people descended from ancestors who experienced extreme suffering want to inflict suffering on others. Perhaps it is simply that it is human nature to always want more than what one has, even when getting more means the people one calls friend and neighbor will have less. Whatever the cause, however ordinary it may be, the behavior is disgusting.

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Posted : June 15, 2009 3:21 am
terry
(@terry)
Expert

There were many territories. Arizona, Alaska, and I believe New Mexico just to name a few. Should the ancestors of the people who lived there before it was purchased get special privileges? The Indians do have their reservations, but they do pay taxes.

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Posted : June 15, 2009 1:53 pm
Yearasta
(@Yearasta)
Trusted Member

Alright DUN let's not be teaching the board new derogatory words....

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Posted : June 15, 2009 2:29 pm
trw
 trw
(@trw)
Expert

a cab driver told me that bert shot his son because the kid was going to expose him publically for all of his naughty corrupt and illegal deeds,3 stories on the street about dornastorg,1 the gov wanted him gone because foncie wanted to repeal 6905 and the gov does not want it repealed,2 he's going to run for gov and wants to be at the opposite end of the political spectrum from dejongh,and 3 he was not doing his job

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Topic starter Posted : June 15, 2009 2:36 pm
A Davis
(@A_Davis)
Trusted Member

i totally understand your position dntw8up. i am also coming to understand more about v.i. history. because others could not achieve this does not mean is not to be achieved. people have a right to try, using the system, to get the things they want. how it plays out, is according to the same system. i still believe that the status of the territory should have been taken on before the constitution... but the constitution may have been that of a sovereign nation instead of one that would be bound to the u.s. constitution. this may not be completed until long after i am gone.

may i live long.

i am now intrigued as to how this will turn out.

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Posted : June 16, 2009 12:03 am
trw
 trw
(@trw)
Expert

yearasta your guy was on morgans show today along with hill and barshinger and all 3 agree with the gov

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Topic starter Posted : June 17, 2009 4:06 pm
Yearasta
(@Yearasta)
Trusted Member

Yep we're trying to keep him in line! I got your puter in the car..still trying to find you...call me tomorrow so I can know where to drop it off.

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Posted : June 17, 2009 9:22 pm
trw
 trw
(@trw)
Expert

chris i work at 2:30 today

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Topic starter Posted : June 18, 2009 5:05 pm
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